Tess of The D'Urbervilles

[Gg]

Hans gave Mordred more layers than the traditional cardboard villain, he made him to be quite a bit more sympathetic, a pawn in the game of politics, trying to make his aunt proud of him while wanting his father's love as well as hating him for being so estranged.

Exactly -- the conflict plays across his face. That's what I like about it. We get to share it! It's been years now since I read Mists

Intellectually I get that historically cousins married -- perhaps it is personal in this case as cousins married in my grandparents generation (and we're all shockingly resemblant and not just a little intense because of it)... I look at my cousins and think -- never in a million years am I even gracing my own ethnic group... Projection on my part. But on a human level -- marrying a cousin whom he obviously loves as family is surely "safe", so much it is dangerous "safe", for both in the end obviously, for Tonja beign unequlaed in the quantity of her love, and the whole Anna influence catalyzing it... But it is precisely all that daydreaming artistic musing that I love about Yuri -- such a departure from the domineering shallowness of so many more "pragmatic"male characters (fictional and otherwise), his heroism if of a diffierent kind -- SO again projection on my part. But isn't that art afterall -- finding that subjective identification -- the AHA Joseph Campbell talks about and Oprah has pilfered since...

Never have been a Wuthering Heights girl -- just not one I read compulsively. A vicariously ambitious woman as my heroine is a hard sell for me. I'm a "Jane" girl though, as Brontes go. I like Hugo, Charles D. however verbous, and Pasternak, even Austen, because they expanded my horizons not just through the characters' experiences but what I learned about the culture, literature, philosophy etc. by that lovely literary tool of hearing their thoughts... I love the Varykino chapter for just that reason. And I love that Hans so beautifully translates it -- in Marius "I understand", in playing Yuri not so much "beautifully" (if that is the Omar version) as intimately, and God help us, even evident in this first glance of Alec, just that deep swallow as she takes his strawberry bate -- wanting awe in all its damaged/ing violence.

But TESS I was pushed through so fast I almost resented the pace... I don't like that I was man-handled through so much literature as a kid in school. We sprinted through Russia like it was a conquest. I like relationship. That requires a bit of meandering, a bit of time, some focus. I resent the lack of respect both in my own experience and in the loss of truly being able to celebrate the literature itself.

But I disgress as usual.

TESS anyone -- although in part I don't want to jinx it by talking about it too much. Looking forward to hearing from those lucky enough to begin watching this weekend.

and PS Star -- you are the cutest thing! I love to hear your always thoughtful perspective! I'm glad you're back!

[Virgil Reality]

Yuri just faffs along writing poetry and daydreaming and wondering why the world sucks so bad.

Best summary of Yury evah!

[Gg]

poor Yuri

[starkiller]

Sept 12, 2008 23:09:59 GMT 8 Gg said:

poor Yuri

Don't worry, he probably wrote a poem about it. *hides* ;D

[starkiller]

And the scene where he tells Morgause that if he wants to be drunk, he will be drunk, but all he wants is for his father to love him. Then Morgause goes and does her Morgausey thing and that's pretty much taken from him by her machinations. I have a lot of sympathy for Mordred. He tried, at least, to break away from the manipulations, but Morgause and Lot were too good at it for him to do so.

Projection on my part. But on a human level -- marrying a cousin whom he obviously loves as family is surely "safe", so much it is dangerous "safe", for both in the end obviously, for Tonja beign unequlaed in the quantity of her love, and the whole Anna influence catalyzing it... But it is precisely all that daydreaming artistic musing that I love about Yuri -- such a departure from the domineering shallowness of so many more "pragmatic"male characters (fictional and otherwise), his heroism if of a diffierent kind -- SO again projection on my part. But isn't that art afterall -- finding that subjective identification -- the AHA Joseph Campbell talks about and Oprah has pilfered since...

Well, he obviously loved her more than that to start with, considering the way he looked at her at the ball before Lara showed up with her pistol. I read Anna's bed scene where she talked about them marrying more as embarrasment on their part, like two kids who don't want to talk about those things in front of the parents, the 'aw, ma, stop it!' type thing rather than anything else. I think the most tragic part of Yuri's story is that he never meets his son, only sees him through the window and then he dies - he dies knowing he has a son with Lara, but never meeting him, never sharing in that son's life with his mother who goes to her own sticky end. Which also again shows more courage on Lara's part by sacrificing herself for the safety of her child rather than have them both be deported to the Gulag.

Stalin's Russia would have been a terrible place to live, not only in fear of the State, but in fear of your neighbors/friends/colleagues dobbing you into the State for whatever reason so they could in some way better their own existence, a kill or be killed, every man for himself existence. And it's the women and Yuri's uncle and Komarovsky and Misha who understand that, although Komarovsky isn't trying to help anyone but himself. Yuri's innocence, his naivete in such a society was always going to be his undoing, even with everything he'd seen and experienced. He only really thinks about going back to Tonja because he's lost her *and* Lara, shows a bit of belligerence when Misha basically tells him to stop being a child and grow up and not make her life more miserable, but even then, it's the belligerance of a child being told he can't have any more cookies before dinner.

I really dislike Wuthering Heights. I had this arguement with my mother and friends who love it, which basically boiled down to idealising two people who were so completely selfish and self-absorbed to the point of destruction of everyone and everything around them, who were totally unlikable characters and who had no redeeming qualities whatsoever. I managed to finish it, although I did throw it across the room a few times in frustration. Unlike Jane Eyre which I love, love, love. But yeah, I've never understood the appeal of WH or why everyone thinks of it as the greatest classic love story when it's about two big babies who can't get over themselves and behave like little twonks to the world around them because they're denied what they think they're owed. Which is not how life works at all. Bah.

I chose to read the classics myself as part of high school, so it was at my own pace. Although back in those dark days when dinosaurs roamed the earth and we had to walk uphill to and from school, in the snow, with bare feet, young whippersnappers don't know how lucky they are, in my day...anyway, back then, I read a lot of Russian lit, particularly Solzenitsyn (can never spell his name right!) and Pasternak, Tolstoy, etc. I read the Brontes and Austen novels when I took Victorian history as part of my university degree, but could never enjoy anything by Hardy - Jude the Obscure made me want to kill myself, it's so depressing, and while Tess isn't quite on that level, it's still depressing enough.

One of the classics I'd love to see Hans do is Demian by Herman Hesse - I would absolutely love to see him in that, either as the main protaganist or Demian himself. That would be such a challenging role (either of them) and it's such a fantastic story, really powerful for all that it's quite short. It's been a bit of fantasy casting there to have Hans as Demian and Christian Coulson as the protaganist, with Demian's mother played by Isabelle Adjani (if I look half as good as she does when I'm her age (45+) I'll be very well pleased).

Star -- you are the cutest thing! I love to hear your always thoughtful perspective! I'm glad you're back!

LOL, I don't often get called cute - obnoxious and opinionated, oh yes! And atm it's more like back-ish rather than back; mum's progress is slow so I'm still doing the dash between two houses type thing and I'm still exhausted. My eyes are very sore and I'd like some sleep very much, but my brain is working overtime, so I've been tossing and turning a lot. Ah, la joie de vie!

[Gg]

: Poor Yuri I say -- you mock him, but all I want to do is feed him a plate of pasta and tell him to keep on expressing and it will all be okay...I quite like poetry...

I have a lot of sympathy for Mordred. He tried, at least, to break away from the manipulations, but Morgause and Lot were too good at it for him to do so.

Did we ever see Mordred actually perform magic as his Aunt does? Because we know him as I child (in both film and book, I think) it is hard for me at least not to see the character with some fondness. A pawn as you say. It is a corrupted strength though isn't it? It is all manipulated and I think knowing him a product of incest does make the megalomania carry a particular mystique.

Well, he obviously loved her more than that to start with, considering the way he looked at her at the ball before Lara showed up with her pistol. I read Anna's bed scene where she talked about them marrying more as embarrasment on their part, like two kids who don't want to talk about those things in front of the parents, the 'aw, ma, stop it!' type thing rather than anything else.

See I totally read those scenes differently than you. I see the decision, the reaction, as safe and motivated by yes love that is maturing perhaps, but steady and true, but also unchallenging. Like marrying someone for stability -- they'd make a good parent, and supportive partner, they'll make enough money... I loved the way the actress played in it in the miniseries because Chaplins film version of her kind of made we say "well obviously" because she played her so meekly -- where Maria was strong and intelligent and a kinswoman.


Although I must admit, a friend of mine just read it for the first time and she kind of wanted to smack him too. I protest and she says of course I'm protesting his sensitive and artistic and vulnerable and damaged i.e. just my kind of guy. She loved it none the less and when I ask why she says its because she enjoys "forbidden sex". She then proclaimed "he's no Anna Carinina" (except she would have spelled the name right)... so I've apparently just got a soft spot. And to each his own. But the infidelity itself I guess I see as human, challenging, hurtful, but not condemnation worthy. I feel absolutely for Tonja, I like her, but I have a hard time condemning Yuri for loving two women in what I see as different ways. I did love Mischa for saying that, for giving Tonja that opportunity to love him -- she deserved it. I wanted her to say yes. I think in the parallel universe where she makes that choice, Yuri would bless it. I too may be naive.

My people came over to escape Mussilini. Musicians and poor farmers and they all talk, in a language I barely understand, in whispers about it... or did. I can not fathom Stalin. I am glad to have to only theoretically consider that from an intellectual distance. But I respect the ideal at least, of individual, artistic rebellion, in the face of that, however foolhardy.


I did it all in High School when the academics were my mornings and training was my afternoons and I have since had to go back and reread just to feel like I had the experience of them. It was all scripts in Uni. My father is so into Austen he couldn't sleep the night after reading Lizzie refused Darcy, the first time. That might explain a bit about the above paragraph perhaps. I do love Austen. I appreciate the humor, the wit. And I am with you on the Bronte issue -- I give Jane to my cousins when they turn 13. I guess I understand -- WH is all very dramatic and I'm suppose to love characters who make DRAMATIC decisions, but I just don't click with Katherine, and Heathcliff's obsession is lessened for my dislike of her. Although I did like Suskind's Perfume but I don't know, somehow that anti-hero is different to me. Maybe because I am not asked to truly empathize, or for that matter romanticise him -- see him as windswept and interesting as we're asked in WH... he's like a Kafka bug... fascinating in alienation.

BUT you are cute -- and opinionated and intelligent and that's what I like about you...and more importantly right now a hero to your mother in your support in the face of difficulty, so be as back-ish only as you can manage -- we should write some romantic poetry about you!

ODE (I think that's Greek actually) to Star
Who's come so far
With a click of the jaw
She fills us with awe.



(Inside joke --was the off side?)

I need a drink.

[starkiller]

: Poor Yuri I say -- you mock him, but all I want to do is feed him a plate of pasta and tell him to keep on expressing and it will all be okay...I quite like poetry...

*dies* I mock because I love. It's the Australian way. Also, you could feed me a plate of pasta, that would be awesome. I could get all literary pretentious on you...oh wait, I'm doing that now! :rofl:

Did we ever see Mordred actually perform magic as his Aunt does?

Iirc, no. I can't remember the line exactly, but when Morgan appears to him in the forest on Orkney, she says something about him having the Gift, etc, so it's implied he has it and can use it, but we don't actually see him do it on screen. I kind of took it as a given that he did (also b.c other mythology of Arthur suggests that he did have some ability), just screen time and editing didn't allow for us to see it.

It is a corrupted strength though isn't it? It is all manipulated and I think knowing him a product of incest does make the megalomania carry a particular mystique.

Oh absolutely, I totally agree with you. I know I harp on about this book, but it really touched me and resonated with me (nothing to do with the fact the author is a friend, it really is an amazing novel), but Mordred - Bastard Son deals with that on a deeper level, how do you come to terms with knowing that your whole existence is based on something so corrupted? I think even for the strongest of people that would be a terribly difficult thing to overcome and could easily drive a person mad with all the 'what ifs' of it.

See I totally read those scenes differently than you. I see the decision, the reaction, as safe and motivated by yes love that is maturing perhaps, but steady and true, but also unchallenging. Like marrying someone for stability [....] Although I must admit, a friend of mine just read it for the first time and she kind of wanted to smack him too.

That's the beauty of reading film isn't it - we all see such different things in it. And a tribute to how good he was in the role that we see different shades within the character, not necessarily wrong shades, b.c I don't personally think there's a right or a wrong way to read a film (actually, I do, but this isn't it and that's a rant for another day. ). I love the character, don't get me wrong, I think his decisions are based on his experiences as a child, with his father committing suicide and being a weak man himself, that forming a lot of his decisions, which is reinforced by the way we are shown again and again that Yuri has never forgotten it, thinks about it all the time. There doesn't seem to be a desire for revenge there, or if it is, it's not as strong as Lara's own desire for revenge, it's more of an impotent sort of melancholy dream sequence of childhood, which I think is where Yuri's essentially trapped himself.

My people came over to escape Mussilini. Musicians and poor farmers and they all talk, in a language I barely understand, in whispers about it... or did.

My father was in a Nazi prison camp, separated from his wife and child until the end of the war, when they escaped to Morocco and managed to find each other again in Casablanca. I'm doing his oral history at the moment - the war years are very slow going as you can imagine. The things he tells me, even though I'm all stoic and unemotional while writing it down, shock me with the terror and awfulness of it all. He lapses from time to time into Langue D'Oc, which I barely speak, so I have to get him to repeat himself in French, as Langue D'Oc is the patois of his childhood and he uses it when he feels a bit too emotionally exposed, so I'm getting a lot of it when he talks about the war.

My father is so into Austen he couldn't sleep the night after reading Lizzie refused Darcy, the first time.

That is so awesome, I went 'AWWW' out loud irl!

I could never understand why all the men in WH wanted Catherine so much. She was so...gah, I can't find the words right now, but it was definitely one of the reasons I kept flinging the book across the room! I tend to argue with books, so there was a lot of shouting by me at the thing. I get the whole gothic romance of it all, and I love that element of the novel, but the characterisations just leave me cold. I feel no empathy for any of them.

I love Anna Karenina, the best two film interpretations I've seen are the Sean Bean/Sophie Marceau one and the Vivienne Leigh one. She's a character I feel loads of empathy for, Vronsky not so much as he ends up being a cad to her in the end. The Russians really know how to write/produce tragedy. A Russian friend of mine is always telling me that tragedy is the greatest and most lasting export of Mother Russia.

BUT you are cute -- and opinionated and intelligent and that's what I like about you...and more importantly right now a hero to your mother in your support in the face of difficulty, so be as back-ish only as you can manage -- we should write some romantic poetry about you!

ODE (I think that's Greek actually) to Star
Who's come so far
With a click of the jaw
She fills us with awe.



(Inside joke --was the off side?)

I need a drink.

Ahahahaha, that's fabulous. I am totally putting that on my LJ userinfo. Hahahahaha! *dies*

[Virgil Reality]

Ahem

Topic?

Couple of interesting articles about the production



Tess of the D’Urbervilles: The rock 'n' roll version of a Thomas Hardy masterpiece

The BBC has also added freshness to the story by casting against type, as in Jones’s case, and going for relative unknowns in the instance of the three leads. Hans Matheson has had parts in a handful of costume dramas; Eddie Redmayne, who plays the well- meaning if fatally deluded Angel Clare, has impeccable theatrical credentials but has stuck to offbeat roles in arty cinema until now.

You have to take exception to parts of this article Relative unknown? Ok , maybe. But, parts in a handful of costume dramas makes it sound like he held the horse. Hello? Doctor Zhivago? Hans part - Doctor Zhivago. Earl of Essex - a major character. Mordred - a main character. Cranmer - main cast etc etc.

Sigh


That's what I call a costume drama! After the Tess Of The D'Urbervilles wardrobe went up in smoke, one man's mission to save the day

Gemma of the adaptations





Scans courtesy of Gemma Arterton Online

This article makes the observation that viewers might have to consider choosing between Alec and Angel .

Hans isn't making it easy for the wimin out there - You're not supposed to be attracted to an archbshop or a rapist.

[Virgil Reality]

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/7612987.stm

View a video of one of the locations used in the filming. Cool.

[Gg]

I suppose we will all take exception to his being called "relative unknown" but it does sound intriguing to say he's done just a handful of workAND LOOK HOW AMAZING HE IS in this role... and we're the ones who discovered it. What a dynamic casting risk...

when truth is it WE who have known forever.



All this does make me gnaw at the bit to see it though.

[manu85]

Hello everyone! They are new, my name is Manuela and write from Italy. My mother is Prague and given that Hans has shot many films in Czech Rep. and I have a great fans!
But I have a problem ... this evening as you know, went on air on television Tess of the D'Urbervilles on the BBC, but I am here in Italy and I can not see it on the site because I can not access there .... Please help me girls!

[Virgil Reality]

Don'[t worry you're not alone. First episode only aired last night in Britain The rest of us have to wait - probably the DVD which will be released in October will be soonest for most of us.

Reviews - reaction generally positive with most negativity directed towards the fact that it's a costume drama at all - specifically, complaints mostly about how clean and wholesome things seem, and how you can't really see "a certain scene" Is that all they have to complain about?

www.theherald.co.uk/features/lastnighttv/display.var.2446207.0.High_class_telly_for_the_masses.php

www.redorbit.com/news/entertainment/1554030/television_review_a_tale_of_two_tesses/

www.telegraph.co.uk/arts/main.jhtml?xml=/arts/2008/09/15/nosplit/bvtv15last.xml

www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/film-and-tv/tv-radio-reviews/the-weekendrsquos-tv-tess-of-the-drsquourbervilles--sun--bbc1-massive--sun--bbc3-930703.html

Seems the reviewers all trying to outdo each other in cynical witticisms

[starkiller]

Sept 15, 2008 7:49:56 GMT 8 Virgil Reality said:

Don'[t worry you're not alone. First episode only aired last night in Britain The rest of us have to wait - probably the DVD which will be released in October will be soonest for most of us.

I might, might have a copy of it incoming from a friend in the UK. Have yet to hear back from her regarding my plea for her to tape it for me. As it's my birthday soon, I figured it would be a good gifty for me!

[Virgil Reality]

But - DVD extras> think I'll spend some of the kids' inheritance.

More reviews

www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2008/sep/15/television.television

www.redorbit.com/news/entertainment/1554818/7_days_tv_pass_the_tess__tess_of_the/

www.tvscoop.tv/2008/09/tv_review_tess.html

www.metro.co.uk/metrolife/article.html?Hardy?_Hardly_in_Tess_Of_The_DUrbervilles&in_article_id=306999&in_page_id=9&in_a_source=

In the meantime, there's Youtube

[Virgil Reality]

TV ratings: Tess debuts with 5.7 million on BBC1

BBC wins Sunday ratings battle in triumph for Tess of the D'Urbervilles

'Tess' defeats new 'Poirot'

The beautiful farm girl who inspired Thomas Hardy to write Tess of the D'urbervilles